shadrak
Newbie
Posts: 13 
Pets I own: Misfit - a black cat
Lando Catrissian - a ginger tabby
Finn - a beagle
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Post by shadrak on May 29, 2013 21:38:08 GMT
We've had 2 cats for a while, and we got our beagle, Finn, in January. He's sweet, but full of energy. We've kept them separated by a baby gate so far.
Finn shows a lot of interest in the cats, but no aggression. In the instances when he managed to get close to the cats, he definitely chased them, but only tried to smell them, never catch or bite them.
However, the cats obviously have no interest in making friends. Whenever Finn sees them, he freaks out. Starts whining, staring, and on bad days jumping and howling.
A few weeks ago we started bringing Finn, on the leash, into the bedroom where the cats were after his walks. He was able to handle it for a few minutes, but started freaking out and trying to jump on the bed after a while. We stopped doing that because Misfit, our 13 year old cat, was starting to scratch the fur off his own back, and we suspect it was out of anxiety. As soon as we stopped, Misfit stopped the scratching.
Now we're kind of at a loss as to what to do to integrate them. We tried luring the cats closer to the baby gate with treats. They'll come right up to the gate. Misfit is braver and will stand his ground and swat at Finn if he comes too close, but Lando, our younger cat, runs to higher ground as soon as he sees the dog coming. The cats have been in front of the gate plenty of times, but Finn just can't get used to them. The anxiety meter just starts rising as soon as he sees them.
A friend suggested we just open the gate and let the chips fall as they may, with supervision, of course. He said since Finn doesn't seem to want to attack the cats, the three of them will eventually figure it out. However, considering that Misfit was having self-injurious behaviors due to the anxiety, we don't want to do that to him again.
Yesterday we brought Misfit into the kitchen and held both of them down near each other. Finn was trying to put his nose into Misfit's fur all over the place, but aside from a lot of wiggling, there were no incidents. Misfit's tail didn't even get big. But, as usual, Finn's anxiety meter started going through the roof, so we decided that was enough for the day.
Any ideas on how to proceed?
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Post by tonib on May 29, 2013 21:47:53 GMT
I'm sorry to say I've no experience of integrating a dog with cats, although I think there are others here who have done this successfully. We have problems integrating our 4th cat, she acts a bit like Finn with one of our older cats and we do segregate her at meal times & overnight so that the other 3 can relax a bit.
I suppose there's a few questions.
I presume that your cats & dog are indoors except when Finn goes out for a walk?
Do the cats get on well together?
How old is Finn & what's his background?
How much training as Finn had?
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shadrak
Newbie
Posts: 13
Pets I own: Misfit - a black cat
Lando Catrissian - a ginger tabby
Finn - a beagle
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Post by shadrak on May 29, 2013 22:01:14 GMT
Yes, both cats are indoor only, and Finn only goes outside with us. The cats get along famously. Finn is between 2-3 years old. The only background we know of him is that he spent a week in a city shelter in January.  As far as I can tell, Finn has had very little training, if at all. He's getting better at sit and stay, but that's about it. |
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Post by cazypops on May 29, 2013 22:30:59 GMT
We have two cats and a 10 month old pup. We didn't keep them separated at all when we brought Jasper home. The younger of the two cats, Bandit is a bit like your Misfit in regard to over grooming. I'd give your friends suggestion a go, just make sure the cats have plenty of escape routes and a quiet spot they can go to. We have a cat tower and Jasper knows that when the cats are on there they are out of bounds. He still get a clout off them when he gets over familiar or too close but the cats are getting him trained.  |
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Post by BorderTerrier on May 30, 2013 8:17:21 GMT
Did you consider what might happen before you introduced Finn into your house with two already existing cats?
It is unfair to let the cats suffer because of a NEW dog.
This is something that should have been considered 'big time' before you introduced Finn into the family.
'Letting the chips fall', as you say, may just lead to a house-chase, however it could also solved all your problems. Like you have to gradually lead up to changing your dog's or cat's diet, you have to gradually lead up to getting the cats used to Finn.
If Misfit continues to self-harm in Finn's presence, I would class it as unfair to continue forcing friendship between the two animals.
I have had no personal experience in this situation, so I may not have offered the advice you wanted.
Best of luck, and I hope Misfit stops suffering, and that no difficult decisions have to be made to keep the already existing cats happy in their own household.
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Post by lotsofcats on May 30, 2013 9:46:51 GMT
I have been in this situation a couple of times but with introducing a puppy not an adult dog. I think in this situation you are worrying too much about what could happen and this is understandable. My situation here may help you - 2 years ago I started to feed a stray cat and my dog Kobi was just over a year old at the time. Even though I have other cats my dog did not take to this cat and whenever he saw her in the garden he would run after her and bark so we ended up keeping him in the house when she was in the garden. We decided to keep the cat as she was pregnant and she would eventually have her kittens in the outdoor cats' shed and pen. One day after she had her kittens she was out in the garden and my husband accidentally let Kobi the dog out - we all froze, expecting the fur to fly but Kobi went up to Kali the cat, sniffed her all over and then she rubbed against him and that was it - best friends!! I think it may be a good idea to try Finn in the same room as the cats but keep him on a lead - they are all probably picking up your anxiety. Try to stay calm and just sit the dog down and make a fuss of him and of the cats, especially Misfit. Try some treats. Try this again and again for longer periods of time and I'm sure all will be okay. Going by what you have written I'd say the signs are good.
Let us know how it goes.
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Post by bextull on May 30, 2013 10:46:41 GMT
When I had a cat, Oscar was similar to Finn. Oscar just wanted to play with her and sniff her, but she wanted nothing to do with him. She was an outdoor cat. Oscar is an indoor-outdoor dog. The cat would not hesitate to tell Oscar to get away with hissing and chasing and she actually got him a few times. That was in her younger days however, eventually when she was on her way out, Oscar got to sniff her and sit with her without being killed. With Oscar, when he was very bad with harassing the cat I would pop him on the lead or long line and use my clicker. I first taught him the 'watch me' command and then every time he went for the cat I would stand on the lead and ask for 'watch me'. As soon as he turned his head to look at me I clicked and he got a treat. Eventually he could be off the lead and trusted not to chase the cat. He did still occasionally go crazy and harass the cat but never as bad as he originally did. I would try what you did in the beginning with Finn on the lead, but this time as soon as he gets excited, leave the room and wait until he calms down before going back in again. And then continue with this until he can stand in the room and remain calm for a few minutes. But then again, letting him and the cats free to sort it themselves could work too. Have a look at these, www.clickersolutions.com/articles/2001b/catsanddogs.htmdeesdogs.com/documents/cat_dog_introduction.pdfI think you need to work on basic commands first. A recall and watch me command along with a good leave it would really help with the situation. Is this your first Beagle? If so, then you're in for a fun adventure! They are awesome little clowns!  I really recommend clicker training. It works brilliantly with Oscar (although, I do not use it for everything) and I find it super for teaching more advanced things. Have a look here for some of the best youtube dog training videos ever! kikopup.com/Dogmantics/Free_Video_List.htmlKikopup is my favourite dog trainer! I love her, and her videos are brilliant. (and on nearly everything dog) She is a 100% +R trainer only and uses a clicker. But don't worry, you don't need to use a clicker at all, he stuff works either way, you can just use a marker word (she has a video on that) instead. Finn sounds like Oscar. (pictures?  ?)  |
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Post by Pawsforthought on May 30, 2013 11:14:45 GMT
I would suggest following your friend's advice, but not with Misfit. What does Lando do with Finn around? I would suggest trying Lando and Finn off together at first with close supervision, and doing this over days or, if necessary, weeks. These things take a lot of time. I imagine two cats at once was just a bit too irresistible for him! Also Misfit's anxiety may be very much adding to Finn's. Whining/howling says to me he doesn't know what to do with his excitement, so you have to show him!
Reconditioning, as Bextull laid out for you, is a very good option too. Teach him a strong 'leave it' which might take you a while! But it's worth it, trust me. 'Leave it' is an extremely invaluable tool. (Our) Finn is told 'leave it' when he approaches the cat, and after weeks/months of teaching him this, giving him a treat when he gets it right and removing him away from the cat when he gets it wrong, he is so much better around the cat. He will sniff his face now, and will walk away after being told to 'leave it'
Don't feel bad because, without much basic training, it's hard to get a dog to do anything really! Get his basic commands - sit, stay, wait, leave it, down etc.
Maybe start practising some of these things near the cats (through the gate) and he'll learn that when the cats are near, he gets treats for doing commands!
Good luck!
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shadrak
Newbie
Posts: 13
Pets I own: Misfit - a black cat
Lando Catrissian - a ginger tabby
Finn - a beagle
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Post by shadrak on May 30, 2013 16:22:10 GMT
Thanks to cazypops, lotsofcats, bextull and Pawsforthought for your ideas. I'll try them, and keep you all posted of our progress. Still haven't figured out how to post pics. ~  I read the help thread on posting pics, and I've tried using Statigram, but all I ever get is the red x. |
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Post by Pawsforthought on May 30, 2013 16:27:17 GMT
Try photobucket.com Upload your pictures onto there, then you get a few codes for each picture. Copy and paste the IMG code into the box you write in and hey presto, a picture in your post! You can put as many as you like in there. Don't go TOO crazy now  |
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Post by CurlyCub on May 30, 2013 16:27:46 GMT
Some of these comments may help with my Jess and Frankie. Frankie still doesn't like Jess and whenever Jess gets too close to him he spits and growls at her. We currently keep them apart (we've had Jess since January also) as things don't seem to be improving.
Jess is the complete opposite of your Finn as she does her best to avoid Frank. She is terrified of him after the few occasions where Frank has been in the room with her and leapt at her. If Jess just barked or growled at him he would leave her alone, I'm sure of that.
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Post by cazypops on May 30, 2013 16:36:06 GMT
When your trying to post photos, are you copying the URL code for forums? I had trouble at first now I find it best to paste the URL code directly into your post. Hope this helps and we get to see Misfit, Lando and Finn. |
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I read the help thread on posting pics, and I've tried using Statigram, but all I ever get is the red x.
